Is Israel About to Sell F16s to ‘Terrifyingly Revisionist” Croatia?’

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Written by Aleksandar Pavic; Originally appeared at strategic-culture.org

According to various Israeli media, during a meeting at the recent Davos World Economic Forum, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Croatian Prime Minister Andrej Plenkovic agreed to “push forward” with a sale of Israeli Air Force F-16 fighter jets worth some $500 million to Croatia. This is not the first time that Israel is offering to strengthen this ex-Yugoslav republic’s military – previous offers were made in 2015 and 2017 – but it must nevertheless be viewed as surprising, in light of the country’s increasing tilt toward Word War II revisionism and increasingly open rehabilitation of its own dark Nazi-allied past.

Is Israel About to Sell F16s to 'Terrifyingly Revisionist” Croatia?'

The Croatian index.hr website recently recapitulated an extensive report by the German Deutschlandfunk public radio, describing Croatia as a country “imprisoned by its own past, which it refuses to face” and “veering increasingly to the right,” in which “radical political discourse” and a “climate of hate and intimidation” predominate, and have actually worsened since the country’s accession to the European Union in July 2013.

The main target of hate is the remaining Orthodox Christian Serb minority (Croats are overwhelmingly Catholic), mostly ethnically cleansed from Croatia during Croatia’s war of secession from Yugoslavia between 1991-95, its numbers having been reduced from about 600,000 (about 12.2% of the population) to fewer than 190,000 (about 4.4% of the population) today. As the German radio report puts it, “In the narrative of national heroism, the enemy role is reserved for the Serbs, except if they give up their identity and declare themselves as Croats.”

What should be even greater cause for alarm, especially for Israel and Jews everywhere, is the report’s assessment that the next phase of Croatian nationalism is the rehabilitation of the WWII Ustashe regime, almost certainly the most despicable of all the Nazi puppet regimes, responsible for the genocide of hundreds of thousands of Serbs and tens of thousands of Jews and Roma.

The German radio report, while certainly newsworthy and valuable, is hardly a revelation. Warnings about Croatia have been circulating for years. Among others, British historian Rory Yeomans, author of books such as Visions of Annihilation: the Ustasha Regime and the Cultural Politics of Fascism, 1941-1945 and The Utopia of Terror: Life and Death in Wartime Croatia, has labeled Croatia’s WWII revisionism as “terrifying,” and that “revisionist views of the wartime Ustasha movement and the Nazi-allied Independent State of Croatia, NDH, have entered Croatia’s political mainstream in recent years.”

This should come as no surprise, in view of the fact that the father of today’s Croatia and its first president, Franjo Tudjman, after whom the airport in Croatia’s capital city, Zagreb is named, along with numerous streets, institutions, parks, schools and public venues throughout Croatia, was a notorious WWII revisionist who emphasized newly independent Croatia’s continuity with the WWII puppet state, which, in his own words, “reflected the centuries-old aspirations of the Croatian people.” His attempt to whitewash his past by attending the opening of the Holocaust Memorial Museum in Washington DC in April 1993, was met by condemnation on the part of Holocaust historians and survivors, including Elie Wiesel and Rabbi Marvin Hier of the Simon Wiesenthal Center for Holocaust Studies.

In a letter to the New York Times of December 24, 1992, David A. Harris, Executive Vice President of the American Jewish Committee, warned of Tudjman’s anti-Jewish views:

“Croatian Jews, Mr. Tudjman wrote in his book ‘Wastelands: Historical Truth’ (1988), used their supposed traits of ‘selfishness, craftiness, unreliability, miserliness, underhandedness and secrecy’ to gain control of the Jasenovac concentration camp (where tens of thousands of Yugoslav Jews and others perished) and victimize others. Jews, he alleged, are commanded to ‘exterminate others and take their place’ because they consider themselves the chosen people. Israeli policy toward the Arabs, according to him, makes them nothing less than ‘Judeo-Nazis’.”

Perhaps Tudjman would’ve been kinder in his remarks had he anticipated that the “Judeo-Nazis” he despised would be offering his own successors (Croatian Prime Minister Plenkovic is also president of HDZ – the political party that Tudjman founded) advanced fighter planes just a couple of decades later. In any case, once again, realpolitik (or, perhaps, just plain greed) has brought together the oddest of bedfellows…

As irony would have it, on the same day (January 25, 2018) that Mr. Netanyahu was pitching his F-16’s to Croatia, Israeli professor Gideon Greif was giving a lecture entitled “Jasenovac – the Auschwitz of the Balkans” at the UN building in New York, as part of a joint Serbian-Jewish exhibition “Jasenovac – the Right Not to Forget.” Jasenovac was the most notorious Croatian WWII death camp, in which, according to the report of a post-war Yugoslav government commission, 500.000-600.000 people were savagely slaughtered, mostly Serbs, followed by Jews and Roma. Dr Greif, a renowned scholar and chief historian of the Israeli Shem Olam Faith and Holocaust Institute for Education, Documentation and Research, deems Jasenovac to have been “even more brutal by its atrocities than Auschwitz.” As he put it in a 2017 interview for the Belgrade daily Vecernje Novosti, as a reaction to Croatian attempts to revise history, specifically the push for the canonization of WWII Croatian Catholic Cardinal Alojzije Stepinac:

“It was hell on earth. That is why in Jasenovac the Croatian hands are completely covered in blood… The Germans had camps for women, men or mixed, where children were with the adults, but the Croats went a step further and even had children’s camps. Horror.”

(Nikola Popović, a member of the Serbian Academy of Science and Arts gives a figure of 24,911 children, mostly Serbian, exterminated in Jasenovac.)

As expected, the Croatian government vehemently protested the exhibition at the UN, accusing Serbia of “manipulating and disseminating false information,” after previously unsuccessfully trying to block the exhibition. Greif would have none of it. In an interview for Deutsche Welle in Serbian, he dismissed the official Croatian complaints:

“In my opinion, this exhibit should in no way be controversial. It is based on historical data and does not contain anything that could not be supported with evidence.”

He also cautioned regarding further attempts at historical revisionism, by Croats and others:

“As a historian, I can only say that the twisting of history is a dangerous thing. And it is dangerous what some people are trying to do in terms of twisting historical facts connected with Jasenovac victims.”

In an October 2017 article for the American Jewish online Tablet magazine, Menachem Z. Rosensaft, General Counsel of the World Jewish Congress, accused today’s Croatia of “brazenly attempting to rewrite its Holocaust crimes out of history.” Enough said.

Finally, it should be added that present-day Croatia is mimicking its WWII predecessor state in another important way – in its enthusiasm to fight on the “Eastern Front.” In July 1941, thousands of Croats enthusiastically volunteered to join the German invasion of the Soviet Union, initially as part of the Croatian 369th Reinforced Regiment of the Wehrmacht, attached to the 100th Jäger-Division, which was ultimately destroyed at the Battle of Stalingrad, where it was the sole non-German unit participating in the attack. But the Croat anti-Russian enthusiasm could not be contained, leading to the formation of the 369th (Croat) Infantry Division, nicknamed “Vražja” or the “Devil’s Division.”

Today, according to Croatian media reports, Croatian troops are, proportionally, the most numerous NATO troops deployed towards the Russian border, in Lithuania and Poland, with a total of 258 soldiers, NCOs and officers (Croatia joined NATO in April 2009). In addition, Croatia has offered to help Ukraine with the “peaceful reintegration of the occupied territories” of Donetsk and Lugansk, prompting Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov to remind of the “peacefulness” of Croatia’s own recent reintegration efforts:

“It is a well-known fact that large-scale military operations by the Croatian army in 1995 resulted in many casualties and the forced the exodus of some 250,000 Serbs from the country.”

Will revisionist and “peaceful” Croatia soon be reinforced by Israeli F-16s, proudly displaying, in what would make for historical irony par excellence, the trademark Croatian checkerboard, barely distinguishable from the notorious Croatian Nazi puppet coat of arms? Stay tuned.

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  • dutchnational

    As Israel is going to replace their F16 planes by the F35, it seems logical to sell their obsolete F16’s.

    On the other hand, Israel still keeps some 200 Kfir fighter planes in a kind of reserve fleet (btw, more up to date than most Syrian planes), though I read somewhere those are for sale too.

    • Bob

      Israeli Kfir’s for sale?! Who would possibly want a load of vintage mid 1970’s Israeli Mirage-5 knock offs – now that really would be money down the drain.

      • Hrky75

        …actually a few south american banana republics, plus Argentina…

        • alejoeisabel

          Macri most corrupt dictator in South America. He was installed by Goldman Sachs and Vulture capitalist hedge fund banker who financed Macri’s campaign.

    • Pave Way IV

      Well, US taxpayers were forced to GIVE Israel 50 F-16As for free (without a vote or consent) to “stay out of Gulf War I” for what can only be described as the most preposterous reasons imaginable. The remaining 75 ‘old’ Israeli block A F-16s were from another theft labeled ‘Peace Marble I’ – discounted heavily as they were intended for the Shah’s AF in Iran but withheld after the revolution. Most of the cost of those 75 to Israel came packaged with loan guarantees, and Congress subsequently forgave nearly ALL of the debt in the succeeding years.

      So Israel is now trying to sell aircraft given to them and paid for by US taxpayers? Why am I not fucking surprised…

    • 888mladen .

      As Israel is going to replace their F16 planes by the F35, it seems logical to sell their obsolete F16’s which both were bought by US taxpayers money.

  • FlorianGeyer

    Is it surprising that Croatia seeks to re-write history when the Israeli’s have been doing that since WW2 ?

    This was after an attempt by Jewish organisation’s in the early 1920’s as well.

    • Amon -Ra- DeArmond

      nothing new,tho Serbia “we dindu nuffin wrong,we wuz Carz an shieeet” is spearheading the charge in rehabilitating war criminals from ww2:
      http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/article/serbia-rehabilitates-chetnik-general-kalabic-05-26-2017
      http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/article/serbia-rehabilitates-wwii-chetnik-leader-mihailovic
      Tho you wont see that on SP because Serbia is an ally of Russia so it can’t do anything wrong,just like Russia.

      • Bob

        Whoa, surprise – guy with Wehrmacht decal stahlhelm avatar is anti-Serb!
        Still, that would be rather in keeping with the Austro-Hungarian’s and Nazi German’s who both invaded Serbia and inflicted vicious acts of violence against the Serb population.

        • Amon -Ra- DeArmond

          how did you come to the conclussion I was “anti-serb”, because of my avatar,lol.The stahlhelm was used by many in both ww’s and the Wehrmacht was the best fighting force in ww2,I can only have respect for them.
          1.You assassinated archduke franz ferdinand and got invaded for it,stop crying about it
          2.Your King joined the Axis and the coup d’etat led by the british overthrew him,instaled a puppet,broke the deal with the axis,which forced Hitler to invade Yugoslavia,liberating all south slavs who serbs treated as second class citizens in Serb Yugoslavia.
          “and inflicted vicious acts of violence against the Serb population” – Vukovar,Srebrenica,Eastern Bosnia,Dubrovnik..etc
          You can pretend to foreigners about “we dindu nuffin wrong” but not to us south slavs,we know your true animalistic nature of ethnic cleansing and the “greater serbia” project.Have a nice day.

          • Bob

            Yep – you just spelled it out – your anti-Serb.
            Plus – you like to rationalize German aggression.

          • Amon -Ra- DeArmond

            Don’t kill foreign heads of states,don’t break deals (as in joining alliances and then leave them) and you might not get invaded it the future.Sorry but I’m not anti serb,I want your country to stop attacking the birthplace of my forefathers and stop ethnically cleansing it for a “greater serbia”.Stay behind the river Drina and do what serb usually do,leave us alone.

          • alejoeisabel

            The Coats have a long and glorious history of vassalage. As Croats tried to become Germans, Serbs were fighting the Muslim Ottomans, and defeating them in the Balkans. Bosnians are Catholic Croats who converted to Islam and became vassal of the Ottomans and participated in the oppression of Serbs.

          • Amon -Ra- DeArmond

            cool story bro

          • Rob, NYC

            The Serbs were defeated by the turks in one year, Croatians fought them for 400 years. Serbs are genetically 36% Turks. While Croatians have less than 1% turkish DNA.

          • Rob, NYC

            Go fuck yourself Bob, you ignorant leftist fascist.

          • Bob

            Well Rob, that was a remarkably pointless and ignorant contribution.
            Noticed elsewhere, you wrote the following remark,’ Long live Israel and Croatia. Judea and Samaria will onco (sic) again be part
            of Israel. Croatians saved Europe from the Nazi Turks in a 400 year war losing one million inhabitants in the name of freedom and Christianity.’
            That combination of absurd claims basically tells the world you are either a disruptive troll or completely and utterly delusional. Nazi Turks? You do realize that Croatia had an actual, genuinely murderous, fascist and Nazi puppet Ustashe regime during the second war with death camps…?
            However, of further historical significance vis-a-vis your absurd claims, and going further back, it was actually a shifting Hungarian-Serbian-Bulgarian alliance that eventually fought the Ottomans out of southern Europe after their mutual experiences of up to 500 years of Ottoman assault and occupation.
            In contrast, Croatia was never actually occupied by the Ottomans and ultimately sat safely behind the Krajina – an Austro-Hungarian initiative to sponsor Orthodox Serbs and Vlachs to move to outer most edges of Austro-Hungarian empire as a military frontier (Krajina means frontier) against any further Ottoman expansion beyond Bosnia.
            The Krajina incentive involved offering free titled land due to special status as default militia, and myopic Croatian princes hated this Austro-Hungarian initiative. As the Orthodox Serbs an Vlachs were invited as free land owners – not feudal serfs – and it undermined the Croatian ruling class’ claim over their own subordinate serfs.

          • Rob, NYC

            Battle of Siget, read and learn son. What are you smoking Bob? I bet you are orthodox? You have ignored historical fact to a maximum. Go back to school young man.

          • Bob

            When someone directs the term ‘son’ in their response they have indicated they are operating from position of profound weakness. That is attempt to claim authority, and talk downwards, in any debate – just without any actual substance or merit to back it up. It is primitive and pathological defense mechanism at work – and easily identifiable to any actual adult. See previous comment in response to your efforts.

          • Rob, NYC

            Mr. Bob you turning to lies and false history is the period at the end of the sentence. Keep supporting the fascist left. That will make people take you seriously for sure. I hope the russians pay you well? Have a great weekend.

          • Bob

            What exactly is false about the Ustashe regime, the Hungarian-Serb-Bulgarian axis that eventually fought out the Ottomans and likewise the Austro-Hungarian facilitated Krajina defense strategy employing Serbs and Vlachs? Name a falsehood in any of that. Your efforts are devoid of any real content – hence your need to resort to the transparent ‘son’ would be insult in your previous response. Lift your game or move on.

      • Don Machiavelli

        Israel moved their embassy from Dodik’s Villa in Belgrade because he ‘bought’ it by fraud. Israelis have more dignity that Serbs.

    • You can call me Al

      Forget all that stuff, have a look at the comment above by Hrky75 – 36 mins ago.

      • FlorianGeyer

        Very interesting and yet unsurprising Al :)

        The good news about this typically Jewish deal is that Croatia will be less of a threat to Serbia with the high maintenance aircraft :)

        • Hrky75

          … and funny part is that Croatian media made fun of recent Serbian purchase of second hand Mig29s of similar vintage from Russia and Belarus. Both air forces will be a grave danger to itself and it’s own citizens and will be bombing only with rusty parts falling off their junk-jets…

          • FlorianGeyer

            If we look at the experience of Syria with the old stocks of Soviet aircraft there , I feel that Russian made , but aged, equipment is easier to maintain and keep running .

          • Bob

            Russia gave Serbia six Mig-29’s with spares parts for around five years of flight time. Obviously they are older configurations and need upgrades – and Serbia will pay for them be modernized in Serbia itself at Batajnica – based on Russian upgrade packages. Whilst they are not new aircraft there is continuity involved as Yugoslavia operated MiG-29’s and Serbia still has three operational models from that original fleet.

          • Hrky75
          • Bob

            Well there are upgrades, and then there are upgrades…

          • Hrky75

            … not so in the realm of aeronautics…Migs air frame is extra light and designed for maneuverability and not durability… and there’s still no technology that can rejuvenate ancient air frames that spent most of 1990s rusting on some abandoned air field east of the Urals…

          • Bob

            It was a joke about 1908…

          • Hrky75

            Rostov or Irkutsk notwithstanding… they weren’t donated for it’s tender years…Russia is grounding it’s Soviet era Mig 29s fast. 31st Figter reg was the last all Soviet mig29 regiment in Russian air force and are getting Su-30s as a replacement…

          • Bob
          • Hrky75

            …made in the early 2000s…half the age of the youngest donation to Serbia…

          • Bob

            Missed the point, MiG-29 is 1980’s design, but it is analogue to F-16, and is nimble and reliable air-frame that remains in Russian service in later iterations.

          • Hrky75

            … I LOVE MIG29… it’s the most beautiful aircraft ever to fly… but it wasn’t made to last long – 2-3 000 flight hours tops as oppose to 6-7000 flight hours for F-16. It’s nothing extraordinary for Soviet 1970s designs. For example Mig-23 was as rugged as they come and designed to burn it’s own engines in just 150 hours. The fact that Mig29s air frames simply don’t last is well known fact and the reason why Algeria returned their refurbished Mig 29 SMTs when they found out that air frames dated from early 1990s and got upgraded Su-27s instead…

          • 888mladen .

            That problem has been solved in later upgrades. Inform yourself.

          • Hrky75

            ..the problem of rusting air frames…really? So now 1980s Mig29 actually CAN fly up to 6000 hours without killing it’s pilots… i suppose that’s just why Russia grounded ALL it’s Soviet era Mig29s not to apply “the latest” upgrade, but to exchange them with Su30s…

          • 888mladen .

            Rusting Aluminium composite air frames?

          • Hrky75

            …well i suppose if they are aluminium composite they can fly forever…

          • 888mladen .

            SY Mig 21 and 23 are still operational. What happened to their “rust”. Where are F 14s F 4s today and soon F 16s will fallow the suit?

          • Hrky75

            You can’t compare Mig 21 or Mig 23 air frame technology with Mig29 – that’s light years apart…man don’t be an ignoramus, google it…BTW Croatian Mig 21s also fly despite Ukrainian mafiosos “servicing” then a decade ago. If that’s not a proof or ruggedness I don’t know what is…

          • 888mladen .

            “You can’t compare Mig 21 or Mig 23 air frame technology with Mig29 – that’s light years apart” Was that a poetic hyperbola?

          • 888mladen .

            The problem were the engines which didn’t last

          • Hrky75

            ..maybe we just didn’t understand each other – that happens when you write in English and not in a common language that we both understand.. I was making a point about Soviet era MiG-29s from 1980s that Serbia got as a donation. Those boys’ air frames lose structural stability and air worthiness in 3000 hours tops. That is universally excepted fact easily confirmed on-line That’s why no self-esteemed AF in the world flies them any more. No amount of upgrades can prolong their life…New Mig 29 variants that entered serial production in mid 2000s allegedly corrected it..Mig 29 engines on the other hand are comparatively long lasting – around 500 hours as oppose to around 700-750 hours for F-18s and F-14s. Mig 23 engines lasted only 150 hours…

          • 888mladen .

            It looks like to your account Syrian conflict has been one of the shortest lasting only 150 hrs.

          • Hrky75

            …seems to me you are trying to double down on ignorance to win an argument…good luck with that dimwit…

          • You can call me Al

            Why are you two arguing ?, you are both on the same side.

          • Hrky75

            ..we are not arguing… just shooting shit about planes…in a friendly and respectful manner…

          • You can call me Al

            Good lad. Can I have a “just shooting” discussion about something soon please.

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          • Bob

            Wilma, why does ‘Google’ have a weird slanted first ‘o’ in your font – could it be because you are not actually from Google, but represent an incredibly poorly constructed scam…cease and desist this silliness.

      • FlorianGeyer

        Thanks for the info Al. It is very relevant .

    • gregorettikarlo

      Evidently writer of this textyou are Serb with anti Croat language, and hedare to deceive whole countries after Serbs besiege Bihać, Sarajevo, Srebrenica, Vukovar, Dubrovnik……..

      and after they killed 200.000 muslims in Bosnia. Whats wrong with you Serbs, how many muslims you killed on Kosovo? You ruined wonderfull country Yugoslavia and attack all former republics except Macedonia. Read your literate Dobrica Čosić what he said about Serbs art of lying. Conclusion, lying is Serbs way of life. And finaly word HRVAT- CROAT is not Europian origin it is Iranian origin. It is very easy check what the Iranian ambassador in Croatia said about origin HRVAT – CROAT. Also we have lot of words in our language similar Farsi language. You can Look at the record in stone on Iranian mountain Baghastan where you can se inscription Harauvatim (HRVAT – CROAT) as one of the twelve demos under king Darije I the great.

      • FlorianGeyer

        And Bosnia today is a soft underbelly of Europe where Salafist terror cells are fermenting attacks on members of the EU . The Black Flag is now to be seen flying in Bosnia.

        • Don Machiavelli

          There are no terrorists in Bosnia, when they were attacked they didn’t commit one single terror act while Srebrenica happened. Grbavica happened. Prijedor happened… Must feel really proud for Russians to support that. And here they ( Russians ) preach about USA’s misdoings while they do the same thing, if not worse. Without USA there would be Srebrenica all over ex-Yugoslavia.

          • FlorianGeyer

            I have to disagree with you Don. A recent documentary interviewed a Muslim Imam who was being intimidated by radical Salafists who are flying the black flag from their homes.

            There is also this article that also discusses Salafist Terrorism in Bosnia.

            https://theconversation.com/radicalisation-in-bosnia-old-wounds-reopened-by-an-emerging-problem-63534

            ” Bosnians have been travelling to Syria to fight for radical Islamist groups in increasing numbers since 2012. They now constitute one of the largest European foreign fighter contingents as a proportion of national population.”

            Germany is particularly worried about terrorism from Bosnia.

          • Don Machiavelli

            You can disagree, that doesn’t mean that i am wrong. This is part of propaganda, continuation of 1990’s war and since forever, Serbian dream was to ‘paint’ Bosnian Muslims as some fanatics.

            First of all Bosnia is secular and Bosnian people practice good Islam, not Wahabbi shits.

            Those affiliated with war criminals would agree with you.

            100% correct info is that about 140 people, fighters with kids and families have gone from Bosnia to fight abroad. Less than 30 have returned and are constantly under watch by state agencies. I would be more concerned about thousands from France or Britain. Anyways, go spit that propaganda but the site which you mention was started in Australia and UK in 2011 :D ” The Conversation launched in Australia in March 2011 and in the UK in May 2013. ”

            Quote from ” about us ” from the site which you linked too. There is no credibility in that article, what do you think i am to fall for that? South Front disappointed me greatly. So do Russians who fall on such dumb propaganda about Bosnia.

          • FlorianGeyer
          • Vince Dhimos

            I don’t believe this is propaganda. This is the result of imported Wahhabism (Salafism), which has taken root in the area,

          • FlorianGeyer

            That is what I was implying Vince. I was being sarcastic and I forget that English Sarcasm is not literally translated into other languages easily.

            I apologise for that Vince. :)

          • FlorianGeyer
          • 888mladen .
          • Zvjezdan Svemirković

            You can take the crimes of Bosniaks and foreign volunteers, multiply it by 30 and that is the number of Serb crimes in Bosnia.

          • Vince Dhimos

            What you say tallies witwhat I have read about the Muslims in that part of the world. Albanian Muslims once had the reputation of being tolerant. The Saudis are trying to change that.

          • Don Machiavelli

            Saudis are trying to change a lot of things along with them Zionists.

          • Bob

            You referring to these ‘invisible’ US-Saudi imported terrorist mujahedin in Bosnia?
            That marching 10,000 mass was in Zenica in 1995 (spot the Bosniak military police officer with white belt upper mid frame)- as for the the individual, just another CIA/ISI imported Afghan/Pakistani jihadist who perceived his task in Bosnia was to kill ‘Christians’.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/5bf1a9865d09c4f7c25205e9ee0c09b2c16017b690fb52c6a70c7122e9f788f6.jpg

            88f6.jpg https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/127c730fa0f3c265faa8c3dd21a52403a5a4485299a5145fb13a304674ab89e0.jpg

          • Vince Dhimos

            Your second link seems to be a translation from a Yugoslav language. Do you have link to the original?

          • Bob

            No just the English translation.

          • Bob

            The actual former Vice-President of the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina, Mirsad Kebo, tabled documents, and made public statements, in 2014-5, regarding the presence, importation and war crimes of the foreign salafist mujaheddin in Bosnia and Herzegovina.
            See:
            https://www.hercegbosna.org
            https://translate.google.co

          • Bob
        • Amon -Ra- DeArmond

          what about this black flag who’s members killed more bosnian muslims than those muslims killed others (ie,christians)
          http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_-HE1lR1mlb8/TO9cNXnVd6I/AAAAAAAADkc/FQwaWTs4b3I/s1600/800px-Chetniks_Flag_svg.png
          why aren’t you going after serbs who wave around this flage of hatred ?

      • Don Machiavelli

        It’s not anti Croat it’s just pro Serb but they ( Russians ) do not realize how wrong the Serb regime from 1990’s was. They dare to say it is western propaganda but what about tens of thousands of dead people? What about Kosovo from 1999? Now it’s proven that DB ( state security ) killed young Serbs in Kosovo and accused the Albanians of that act. It’s written all over Serb medias, with even Legija’s name mentioned as perpetrator.

        But Russians will always blindly follow such narrative and it is only thing which always wake me up and prove that Russia is not better than USA, as long as they keep supporting war criminals. There goes SF credibility.

      • dutchnational

        To be fair, Montenegro was let go, in the end, without any bloodshed, as was Macedonia, and Slovenia after a kind of fake war lasting just 9 days with hardly any bloodshed.

        In Croatia and Bosnia Serbs behaved atrociously though as they did later within Kosovo.

        Tbh, Serbs and Croats are one nation divided by religion, history and a different alphabet, nothing more but seemingly enough.

        Serbs always have been enemies of Turkey and muslims (as fo 14th century), in fact being invited by the Austrian empire to start living on its border with Turkey (present day Croatia) which is how Serbs came to live there as militants against muslims/Turkey and feeling superior to Croats.

  • bcbingram

    Did the U S give or sell the planes to Israel ?

    • You can call me Al

      Hrky75 has the answer above, which I have checked and yep its right.

    • alejoeisabel

      What has Israel ever paid for. Israel gets loan guarantees. US taxpayers pay for the loans. Israel never pays for the loans it gets from the US. After all they are guaranteed by the US taxpayer. Notice that Israel never goes to the International Monetary Fund.

      • Abe Manhattan

        Israel uses US military aid to buy planes. The loan guarantees are for other spending.

    • Vince Dhimos

      The US couldn’t give anything to Israel. Israel and the US are one country.

  • Hrky75

    Guy’s it’s all about money and large kickbacks and nothing to do with history or politics. Croatian government refused brand new SAAB Grippens in exchange for 500 mil USD worth of heavily modified and non-NATO compatible Israeli jets some of whom were made in mid 1980s. The planes were deemed no-airworthy by IAF i 2016/17. And the reason for Croatia to go shopping in the first place was to – quote – take care of it’s air force for next 20 years. What are the chances for an F-16 made in 1988 to successfully operate until 2038 – without being a greater danger to it’s own pilot then to an adversary? So how come a second hand Israeli old timer is a better choice then brand new Grippen? Easy! Israeli weapons deals are famously corrupt – so much so that even Bibi is facing a “trial of the century” for skimming of millions in submarine deal. Swedes, on the other hand, are famously stingy when it comes to paying bribes. And to top it all – after 500 mil for a bunch of junk yard planes we already know that the cost of keeping them in the air will cost approx 500 mil USD more. And guess which Croatian government minister just recently had his old company register for plane maintenance and trading with weapons and weapon parts? You guessed it – the Minister of defense. And for those that think Croatia is in Central Africa, unfortunately we are members of EU….

    • You can call me Al

      Thank you, thank you, thank you.

      I had a feeling that the Author was muddying the waters, when he stated “Orthodox Christian Serb minority (Croats are overwhelmingly Catholic)”, which stumped me, as to me the religious side of doesn’t seem to come into play.

      Your comments makes perfect and logical sense:

      From:
      https://thaimilitaryandasianregion.wordpress.com/2017/05/28/saab-hopeful-croatia-will-enter-market-for-fighter-jets/

      To:
      http://aa.com.tr/en/europe/croatia-agrees-to-buy-israeli-f-16s-for-500-million/1043736

      I suppose that the Croatian “anti-Russian” and “anti-Serb” mentality also helps.

      • Vince Dhimos

        Anti-Russian equates to anti-Orthodox. The anti-Russian sentiment is partly religious. the Catholics are re-enacting the wars of the Schism. This helps explain why the big confrontation is with Russia, NOT China. http://www.newsilkstrategies.com/opinion/can-the-pope-ever-put-the-schism-behind-him

        • You can call me Al

          Maybe from your view, but to a Protestant, it is not just the Russians that are Orthodox Christians. But OK.

          • 888mladen .

            Protestant? You mean daughters of the mother of harlots?

          • Vince Dhimos

            Did you think I was not a Protestant?

        • 888mladen .

          Excellent observation. “the wars of the Schism” as an equivalent to Jihad.

          • Vince Dhimos

            Thanks! Yes, that is what it is.

          • Ono&Dsz

            Kaldana?

        • Zvjezdan Svemirković

          I think that you put too much weight on religion. When Serbs committed crimes on the Balkans, they did not seek inspiration in the Bible, but in the policy of Greater Serbia that includes ethnic cleansing and in radical nationalism.
          Croatia is more influenced by the West, and Serbia under the influence of the East, so it has influenced the choice of religion, but without religion the
          political and economic influences of the West and the East would remain.

      • alejoeisabel

        The Roman Catholic and Orthodox divide is real and defining. There is a real and dividing difference in Ukraine along religious lines. The Ukraine was a Polish Catholic vassal state. There were mass forced conversions to Catholicism.

        • 888mladen .

          Yet another man who knows his history.

        • dutchnational

          In fact, there are now three Ukrainian orthodox churches.

          First the one that follows the Moscow Patriarch, secondly the one that follows the independent Patriarch of Kiev and thirdly the orthodox church that recognises the Pope as head of the church but is in its rites wholly orthodox. The latter church was persecuted by the communists and is mostly in western Ukranine, Lviv etc.

          There is even a foruth one, the Ruthenian Orthodox chhurch, mostly in exile.

          As for being a polish catholic vassal state, Ukraine was mostly part of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania which became a dual state with the Polish kingdom somewhere in 1386 up till 1791.

      • 888mladen .

        as to me the religious side of doesn’t seem to come into play. To you coming from Darwinian materialistic world view will “never seem to come in play”. To those of like ideological background religion is zero factor in shaping of this world. That’s the reason why they have a big hole poked in their understanding of the world affairs.

    • Bob

      If the previous 2013 Croatian warplane acquisition was anything to go by you are spot on. Croatia made a truly woeful deal to buy dozen refurbished MiG-21’s from Ukraine. At the worst possible time under the newly minted Poroshenko roller coaster regime. Needless to say on arrival most were unsafe and serviceable. After Maiden events Ukraine was in conflict with Russian and unable to access MiG parts from Russia – so these Ukrainian MiG-21 exports to Croatia were complete bitsa’s – with non matching parts on single airframes sourced everywhere from Algeria to Bulgaria. That deal must have involved some serious corruption – because someone opted to squander Croatia’s limited military budget on unusable warplanes.

      http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/article/croatia-investigates-military-jets-deal-with-ukrainian-company-03-22-2016

      https://www.rt.com/news/337010-ukraine-fake-jets-croatia/

      • Hrky75

        To correct you on that, Croatia made a deal to refurbish their Mig21s (bought in Germany during 1990s) with a shady company in Odessa. Delivery of refurbished planes was months late, some planes had faulty parts some leaked oil and several had engine problems – engines shutting down in mid air. Refurbishment was paid 1 mil USD per plane, real costs were around 70K USD + parts and the rest of the money was divided between Ukrainians and Croatian politicians…

        • Bob

          My mistake deal was refurbish seven and buy five allegedly ex-Jordanian models that were the bitsa’s. But it was farcical episode.

  • Vince Dhimos

    This should not surprise anyone. The Kosovo war was actually a religiously motivated war pitting Christians against radical Muslims. Today, there is not a single church in Kosovo-Metohija that has not been desecrated and most are razed to the ground. This is partly due to the Saudi Wahhabist influence since the war. Pope John II sided with Kosovo secession almost immediately. In other words, Muslims are not a problem for the Vatican, who only sees Orthodoxy as an enemy. SICK! http://www.newsilkstrategies.com/news–analysis/desecration-of-churches-a-new-european-standard

    • alejoeisabel

      Let’s hope that this Pope can reverse course.

    • Zvjezdan Svemirković

      It is not true that it was religiously motivated, but nationally. Kosovo is part of the story of the collapse of Yugoslavia. Milosevic came to power with the help of the covert nationalist Serbian elite, who wanted to expand Serbia’s power. Milosevic began with nationalist rhetoric and clashed with the Communists and won. He took Kosovo’s autonomy status. Other nations felt threatened.
      Like other peoples, Albanians have a stronger national feeling than religious. So they often clashed with the Ottoman Empire.
      But as today’s fashion, it seems that your central thought is “they are Muslims” a kind of stupidity.
      “These are Muslims, so they must be bad, and these are Christians and they must be good.” So you have to wake up from this black and white cartoon movie.

  • gustavo

    Making business with USA tax payers to get double benefit. Good….Most of the northamerican religious people think that they will be save (nuclear war) after dying because they have helped a jew (money to Israel)……poor sick mentality.

    • 888mladen .

      They think so because they don’t know their Bibles.

  • Don Machiavelli

    Totally biased reports about situation in Balkans. Serbian propaganda in this article fir most part.

    • alejoeisabel

      Hasbara perverts reality. You have had too much hasbara.

    • 888mladen .

      It seems like we have some extraterrestrials in this discussion.

      • Don Machiavelli

        It is mostly propaganda Mr. Mladen. The fact that you are the Serb really proves my point.

        • 888mladen .

          That was exactly the proof Croatian Nazis used for genocide over Serbian population in Croatia and BH during WWII and after the brake up of YU in 1991. It was enough to be Serbian in order to be murdered in called blood. You are in good company mate. By defending their crimes you have become liable of the same. Don’t worry you’ll never be taken to the kangaroo court in Hague. However this one nobody will miss including you and me.
          For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil. Eccl 12:14

  • Mikronos

    Wasn’t it the Croatians who had their MiG fighter fleet turned into ‘gate guardians’ by the bunglers at EUkrainian Aerospace and plane fixers? Hopefully the Croats won’t be buying into Kyiv’s F-16 fix-up specials – the Ukrainians probably have a manual to read while they’re waiting for their free F-35’s.

    • 888mladen .

      All that has been a part of the incremental plan based on Hegelian dialectics.

  • alejoeisabel

    You can tell who calls the shots in Washington. The US gives Israel, at taxpayer expense F-16. Israel pays nothing. Now, as Israel get more free and more advanced aircraft, they need to get rid of their older jets. What better customer and an Anglo/Zionist vassal state like Croatia.

    • Hrky75

      …and then you have Bibi praising the Serbs as the second oldest nation on earth – after the Jews of course – with mutual friendship that lasts since – wait for it – the days of the Roman Republic…
      Add to that the fact that present day Serbia quite happily shipped weapons and ammo to Syrian rebels on behest of US, just like Croatia and Bulgaria, so pls point out a Balkan state(let) that isn’t aglo/zionist vassal…

  • 888mladen .

    Croatia is no different from Ukraine when it comes to ideology. It is well known that Zionists had intimate relationship with Nazi Germany leadership prior and during the WWII.

    • Hrky75
      • 888mladen .

        Zionists have never cared for ordinary Jews. They couldn’t care the less how many ordinary Jews were slaughtered by Nazis.

    • gregorettikarlo

      888mladen, evidently you are Serb with anti Croat language, and you dare to deceive whole countries after Serbs besiege Bihać, Sarajevo, Srebrenica, Vukovar, Dubrovnik……..
      and after you killed 200.000 muslims in Bosnia. Whats wrong with you Serbs, how many muslims you killed on Kosovo? You ruined wonderfull country Yugoslavia and attack all former republics except Macedonia. Read your literate Dobrica Čosić what he said about Serbs art of lying. Conclusion, lying is Serbs way of life. And finaly word HRVAT- CROAT is not Europian origin it is Iranian origin. It is very easy check what the Iranian ambassador in Croatia said about origin HRVAT – CROAT. Also we have lot of words in our language similar Farsi language. You can Look at the record in stone on Iranian mountain Baghastan where you can se inscription Harauvatim (HRVAT – CROAT) as one of the twelve demos under king Darije I the great.

    • gregorettikarlo

      888mladen, you know very well fact about muslims after Turks leave Serbia and Croatia before several centuries. Serbs demolitioon and distroy about 500 mosques in Serbia, but in Croatia in second world war we have lot of muslim soldiers in well known divisions like Handjar division.
      They were called “flower off Croats” Unfortuntly it is too bad because they were under Croat fashist goverment, but it is truth that we have lot of Croats with muslim religion like our former minister off education and culture ZLATKO HASANBEGOVIĆ. Look our mosques in towns Zagreb, Rijeka…. and that is truth.

    • Abe Manhattan

      I love when people say ‘it is well known’ and then make stuff up. I suggest starting school again at first grade, but this time , pay attention to the class about reliable sources of knowledge. Also, logic class wouldn’t hurt.

      • 888mladen .

        What reliable source do you suggest? CNN, MSN, BBC or El Jazira ?

  • 888mladen .
    • Hrky75
    • Hrky75
      • 888mladen .

        Mainly made up of Serbian minority from Zagora.

        • Hrky75

          …and who were chetniks in Djuic’s Dinara division if they were all partisans… I suppose those guys on ships at 2:45 were famous Kistanje big game fishermen…you are funny…

          • 888mladen .

            Djuic’s cetniks were evacuated to Canada after capitulation of Italy. The back bone of resistance in YU during WWII was made up of Serbians. Tito’s Communists lamented a fact that Croatians played negligible part in it.

          • Hrky75

            Unfortunately for you I know too much…you can sell your propaganda to an occasional westerner but not to me…. for example how about a story of the most famous Serbian anti-fascist icon – a Croat Stjepan Filipović, captured by Kosta Pećanac, handed over to Gestapo and then hanged by Nedić SDS…Stoy of Serbian non-Communist “resistance” in a nut shell…
            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e476f1dda78f7ec6a58f8e46b440e57faf0daa6c0a43a23a7db8dfb4c2d67165.jpg

          • 888mladen .

            The fact is that you have the same understanding of the Balkan’s history as an ordinary westerner.

          • Hrky75

            …ah, religion – last refuge of scumbags…there are many retards here that finish there comments praising God and citing scriptures as an apparent excuse for promoting hatred and death…I suggest you join them, you have so much in common with the jihadi trolls…allahu snakbar , you poor little knobhead…

          • 888mladen .

            A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good
            things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil
            things. Math 12:35

          • Hrky75

            …you have problems understanding even the 10 commandments, let alone the Gospels…in your case especially 9 and 10…I suggest also following the Golden rule of Jesus…but that would imply you let go of all that hatred, so I won’t be holding my breath…

          • Hrky75

            That’s why 3000 Croats from Dalmatia lie dead in the forests of Sutjeska…You know Zionist Hasbara pisses me off, but when Draža adoring nationalist starts BS-ing about history – hasbara pales in comparison…

          • 888mladen .
          • 888mladen .

            You seem to be ignorant.

  • Rob, NYC

    Long live Israel and Croatia. Judea and Samaria will onco again be part of Israel. Croatians saved Europe from the Nazi Turks in a 400 year war losing one million inhabitants in the name of freedom and Christianity. That is the equivalent of China losing 1.5 billion people in a war. Index.hr is a leftist fascist news site. Southern Front seems to be a pro leftist-fascist site also. Israel and Croatia together against sharia, nazis and jihad. Shalom

    • Ono&Dsz

      Bravo !!

  • Ono&Dsz

    Mister Aleksandar Pavic (writer of this article) you are referring to the Croatian index.hr website and we all know that this site is pro-Serbian and pro-Yugoslav site. So, please give us real information without info from such rubbish yellow sites like index.hr .

    • Hrky75

      …and being last men standing in other people’s fight helped Croatia how exactly? …and you neglect to mention that the survivors formed a brigade that joined the partisans and fought to liberate Serbia from the Nazis…talk about long way home…

      • Ono&Dsz

        That is a myth

        • Hrky75

          Nope. That’s history. And it is usually more interesting and complex than the craziest myth. Col Marko Mesić finished his military carrier as a partisan fighting in northern Serbia and lived until 1982 on his partisan pension. So take care what you use for avatar…

          • Ono&Dsz

            Yes, but he leave his tattoo with big U on his arm… ;)

          • Hrky75

            He was a professional soldier and a domobran colonel, never a member of ustashe that usually recruited illiterate peasants from Bosnian shit holes – so I don’t think he had any tatoos my ignorant friend…

          • 888mladen .

            He was a professional soldier just like all other Nazis fighting in the battle of Stalingrad.

          • Hrky75

            …and like all the Chetnik officers that happily collaborated with those same Nazis. Mesić had guts enough to take up arms against the Nazis in the and to expunge at least some of his sins liberating your country. All the while your gallant Chetnik officers ran away together with Nazis and Ustashe – some to the West along Vatikans rat lines and some as far as tank ditches in Slovenija…

          • 888mladen .

            He had enough guts to run for his life seeing what was coming to him after all the crimes he had committed.

          • 888mladen .

            “It you can’t beat them join them” is an old saying. Joining the fight of any ideological group by an individual it doesn’t warranty that he has accepted their ideology. It might be just a matter of personal survival which I strongly believe was the case in that heroic act of Marko Mesic. He has managed somehow to “redeem” his crimes like Tony Blair and Karol Wojtyla.

          • Hrky75

            …well he could have run to Canada with Djuić and the Ustashe but he chose to risk his life fighting to liberate a country that gave us morons like you…come to think of it, maybe he should’ve just cut his loses and run…

  • Ono&Dsz
  • Cheryl Brandon

    LET US CLEAR of the HISTORICAL FACTS.
    LIE; There were no Palestinians living in Palestine when most of the European JEWS arrived in Palestine in 1948.
    FACT; There were almost 1,000,00 Palestine living in Palestine owning 96% of Palestine. There were 330,000 Jews owing 6%

    SEE; Justine Mc Carthy;The Population of Palestine Population
    Statistics of Late Ottoman Period and the Mandate New York Columbia
    1990+ ILan Pappe/Wikepedia/ see Walid KHalidi both agree that the JEWISH
    population 1897-1946 was 4%_6%.

  • Zvjezdan Svemirković

    The
    same can be said for sales of Russian aircraft to Serbia, where again they
    rise Chetnik movement, which collaborated with the Nazis and Italian fascists
    against the Partisans. Chetniks did numerous crimes against Croats, Muslims and Gypsies. They collaborated with Ustashas against the Partisans in one period (1942-1943). What the Ustasha were in Croats, the Chetniks are in Serbs. They did revenge on each other, through mass slaughter of civilians. Chetniks also killed many Serbs, who had crossed the partisans, and their families. The Chetniks were known for their crimes, and today such atrocities are called terrorism what we can see in Syria and Iraq. They spread
    terror, doing ethnic cleansing for Great Serbia (against Croats, Muslims, Gypsies, killed even Serbs who were loyal to Croatia) . They
    represent themselves as defenders of Serbs, but they did terrible
    crimes and thus provoked the Ustasha response against Serbs.
    Like the
    Chetniks of Mihailovic, Dujic’s Chetniks accept the radical Greater
    Serbian political program which includes the “ethnic cleansing” of the
    territories on which Serbs claim the right. According
    to the elaboration of the Dinaric Chetnik Division of March 1942, the
    main objective of the program of these Chetnik groups was to “create a
    large Serbia, which would include: Serbia, Vojvodina, Bosnia,
    Herzegovina, Montenegro, Dalmatia (to Šibenik) and Lika”. In such an imagined Serbian unit, “there only orthodox population can live” (Jelic, pp. 124).
    In the last war, Serbs committed aggression against Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia. If
    they did not start conflicts against Croatia, their number in Croatia
    would certainly not be reduced because the war would not be. When the Croatian army liberated the occupied parts of the country, many Serbs fled.